Wednesday, February 12, 2014

More on Geeks and Culture

MC wrote up an impressive post about Women and gamers. This video does support his views on the subject.
However, I am still not sold on Anita Sarkeesian. The bigger problem I have is the branch of extreme geeks.  They are the ones sending her threats and other mean things instead of calling her out on some of the flaws in her videos. She shuts down her comment sections due to the extreme views from guy geeks, when they should be taking the high road and point out the flaws in her claims. When the extremists become the story, the counter points are lost. It becomes a story about ALL geeks attacking her because of her video series and not because of a difference in points of view.  The one getting attack can dictate the discussion because they're the ones viewed as the level head ones.  
Letting the extremists geeks take over the discussion means the other side can refocus the discussion on them and not the real stories about women and characters in gaming.  having a real discussion the guy/woman geek culture is worth having, but we need to stop with the extreme talk first from the guys.  I understand the anger because 10-20 years ago, women looked down on guys that played videogames.  Being a D&D player or a RPG gamer meant you were never going to talk to a woman...ever.  I've lived through those times and perhaps it is a time for a change (sorry, Obama).  
MC and this guy gave me a different side of the story. Maybe, we as nerds are trying to close out the people we once called enemies.  MC has opened my eyes a bit, but I still can't side with Anita.  I just not sure Anita is the right person to give a fair look at women in videogames.  


MC said...

I am not asking you to side with her views. I am saying the amount of hate, abuse and threats directed at her before she had started was so out of proportion to the thing she was doing that it is staggering to me.

Like you said, that behavior takes reasoned criticism largely off the table. Rather than that portion of the community saying "I legitimately have disagreements with your point of view or methods/conclusions," it becomes a matter of saying "You should not be speaking, and we are going to try to stop you," which isn't good for anyone.

In my comments, I posed the question what would you or I have to do or propose to do that would result in that amount of hatred and abuse?

If one of us had decided we were going to make a series of videos about games and we were crowdsourcing money for it, do you think what happened to her would have happened to us?

Semaj said...

Sure, we would get some hate, but not as much as she's gotten. I just think she adds another layer to the issues we're trying to discuss. I have a huge problem with gamers attacking female developers and it is clear thuggish behavior.

A woman gets attacked for her positive review of GTA5. She was actually one of the few reviewers able to put aside one negative aspect of the game and give it a highly positive review. She did her job above beyond. Even I can't do that when something sticks in my crawl (Like Signs and the Happening).

Sadly, we have to remind these extremists that they're only games and stop taking them so seriously. Relax, fanboys, no one is Femin-ing your COD or Battlefield. We just want a measure and knowledgeable discussion on the opposite side without the venom. That's what I want to see and hear. Let's get into discussions as how to socialize male fanboys into talking to women.

(If I ever get a chance, I should tell the story about a guy friend that posed as a woman on FFXI. It was interesting to say the least.)

MC said...

An interesting read about a problem underpinning this debate:

Semaj said...

Agreed, they're a small but vocal group that enjoy leaving a firestarter comment and leaving a burning house in its place. I was just reading a troll comment in a Hollywood story about one of the Kardashians. (some tried to throw in an Obama comment linking him to her) There's trolling and then there's out of line trolling like making up a game to beat up Antia's face or sending sexually charged photos to women in gaming.

Good story, and I am checking out the post about griefing.

From what I take from the study, there really isn't a true way end trolling.

MC said...

Well, there is a way to mitigate them.

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